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Using SSD in pseudo-SLC mode


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#1 FelipeRolim

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Posted 14 October 2021 - 01:49 AM

Hello everybody. I have been carefully reading the evolutions of SSDs introduced in the audiophile market, but the changes were significant and, I confess, removed all my reference. To date, all SSDs I've tried worked better when using independent power supply and SATA connection with a better quality cable. The NVMe SSD have never played better, and my judgment in this regard was mainly due to the poor power provided by the motherboard. Because of this, I keep the 2.5" SSD with the SATA cable and I have no complaints about it.

 

However, the introduction of an SSD into the audiophile market was marked by three main changes: first, the introduction of a clock oscillator better quality; second, the introduction of an independent power supply path for the NVMe SSD, something that didn't exist until then, and; third, the use of a TLC SSD in pseudo-SLC mode. Without a doubt, I'm not able to modify an SSD to insert a better clock or an independent power path into it, but I believe I can try a 2.5" SSD that is TLC or MLC in pseudo-SLC mode.

 

Questions: has anyone done this? What are the requirements? Is there any easy setup method that allows the comparison? My Samsung 840Evo, if I'm not mistaken, is MLC, so having 1TB I could use it in pseudo-SLC mode with 500GB, the which is more than enough for me. First of all, though, I'd like your friends' opinions.


  • Chanh likes this

- Speakers KEF Reference 203/2 with spikes;

- Schiit Freya preamp. (with Electro-Harmonix 6SN7 Gold-Pin tubes and Synergistic Research Orange Fuse) and Audio Research VS115 (with Tung-Sol KT120 and Svetlana 6H30 tubes and AMR Gold Fuse);

- DAC Ayre QB-9 192/24 + Furutech FI-03 ( R) + Synergistic Research Orange Fuse;

- Digital transport: the Control-PC is a dedicated computer with a Gigabyte H310N motherboard, a Intel Core i3-8100T processor, an Arctic Alpine 12 Passive Cooler, 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 RAM 2400MHz and 1TB Samsung 840 Evo SSD; the Audio-PC is a dedicated computer with a Gigabyte H310M M.2 2.0 motherboard, a Intel Core i3-9100T processor, an Arctic Alpine 12 Passive Cooler, 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 RAM 2400MHz and a JCAT USB Card FEMTO. Both computers use Windows Server 2019 Datacenter Core Mode (17763.737) with RAMdisk as Operational System, JPLAY FEMTO Alternative version, Minority Clean and Audiophile Optimizer v. 3.00 (1A in Control-PC and 4D in Audio-PC). Both also use hand made linear power supplies with a Furutech FI-06 ( R).

- Cables: Nordost Tyr (speaker), Nordost Valhalla XLR and Siltech 770i XLR (interconnects), Curious Evolved USB Cable, Nordost Valhalla Power Cable (preamp.), Transparent PowerLink MM2 (power amp.), 2 x Purist Audio Design Canorus Praesto Revision Power Cable (power distributor and computers), Purist Audio Design Limited Edition Praesto Revision Power Cable (DAC) and Jupiter Pure Silver Cotton Insulated (all internal wires from the computers).

- Acessories: Furutech GTX-D (G); Furutech GTX-D ( R) (x2); Sunrise Deep Line (x3); ebony spikes, carbon fiber bases; Nordost Qv2 (x3); acoustical and electrical reinforcements.


#2 Dev

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Posted 14 October 2021 - 04:08 AM

https://audiophilest...or-audiophiles/



#3 seeteeyou

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Posted 14 October 2021 - 08:47 AM

Well, SLC SSDs @ 480GB / 960GB are still available at the moment while latency should be superior when compared to the ones with pSLC NAND chips

 

https://www.anandtec...nand-ssd-review

https://insights.sam...age-performance

https://www.legitrev...s-arrive_207725

 

As little as 1,515 RMB (about $235) for 480GB version / 2,868 RMB (about $445) for 960GB version of Samsung 983 ZET

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/114786487979

https://item.taobao....id=611504434170

https://www.aliexpre...2470322590.html

https://www.aliexpre...3223010790.html

https://www.aliexpre...3319685884.html

 

And then Taiko Audio picked Intel Optane for their flagship SGM Extreme for a reason, IMHO its latency should be unmatched since the others couldn't even hold a candle when compared to 3D XPoint.

 

FYI - it's just a matter of paying someone to get the clock replaced by OCXO while external power could also be done

 

https://audiophilest...comment-1088683

https://audiophilest...comment-1088689


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#4 FelipeRolim

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Posted 14 October 2021 - 02:10 PM

 

Sorry, but I don't want to read this thread, I know it. My questions are related to it, but not directed at it. I'm asking about the personal experiences of other users. In the end, what I would like to understand exactly is: among the improvements obtained by the audiophile SSD, what is the responsibility of the independent power supply, what is the best quality clock and what is the pseudo-SLC mode.

 

Well, SLC SSDs @ 480GB / 960GB are still available at the moment while latency should be superior when compared to the ones with pSLC NAND chips

 

https://www.anandtec...nand-ssd-review

https://insights.sam...age-performance

https://www.legitrev...s-arrive_207725

 

As little as 1,515 RMB (about $235) for 480GB version / 2,868 RMB (about $445) for 960GB version of Samsung 983 ZET

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/114786487979

https://item.taobao....id=611504434170

https://www.aliexpre...2470322590.html

https://www.aliexpre...3223010790.html

https://www.aliexpre...3319685884.html

 

And then Taiko Audio picked Intel Optane for their flagship SGM Extreme for a reason, IMHO its latency should be unmatched since the others couldn't even hold a candle when compared to 3D XPoint.

 

FYI - it's just a matter of paying someone to get the clock replaced by OCXO while external power could also be done

 

https://audiophilest...comment-1088683

https://audiophilest...comment-1088689

 

There are some interesting issues with this: in my case, the entire operating system goes into RAM, so latency for certain tasks won't be any problem. The SSD, after loading Windows into RAM, works exclusively for reading music, which even in pseudo-SLC mode should be a pretty easy task. What's more, the curiosity I have about 2.5" SSDs would be to take advantage of the power supply I have, i.e., try the sound result comparison under the same circumstances. Switching to PCI-Express standard would completely remove my parameter.

 

If there's an easy way to try pseudo-SLC mode, I'm sure I will. I could swap the 1TB SSD for a 2TB one and have plenty of storage for everything I listen to.

 

PS.: Apacer has an interesting option (https://industrial.a...ww/SSD/SS130-25).


  • Rob likes this

- Speakers KEF Reference 203/2 with spikes;

- Schiit Freya preamp. (with Electro-Harmonix 6SN7 Gold-Pin tubes and Synergistic Research Orange Fuse) and Audio Research VS115 (with Tung-Sol KT120 and Svetlana 6H30 tubes and AMR Gold Fuse);

- DAC Ayre QB-9 192/24 + Furutech FI-03 ( R) + Synergistic Research Orange Fuse;

- Digital transport: the Control-PC is a dedicated computer with a Gigabyte H310N motherboard, a Intel Core i3-8100T processor, an Arctic Alpine 12 Passive Cooler, 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 RAM 2400MHz and 1TB Samsung 840 Evo SSD; the Audio-PC is a dedicated computer with a Gigabyte H310M M.2 2.0 motherboard, a Intel Core i3-9100T processor, an Arctic Alpine 12 Passive Cooler, 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 RAM 2400MHz and a JCAT USB Card FEMTO. Both computers use Windows Server 2019 Datacenter Core Mode (17763.737) with RAMdisk as Operational System, JPLAY FEMTO Alternative version, Minority Clean and Audiophile Optimizer v. 3.00 (1A in Control-PC and 4D in Audio-PC). Both also use hand made linear power supplies with a Furutech FI-06 ( R).

- Cables: Nordost Tyr (speaker), Nordost Valhalla XLR and Siltech 770i XLR (interconnects), Curious Evolved USB Cable, Nordost Valhalla Power Cable (preamp.), Transparent PowerLink MM2 (power amp.), 2 x Purist Audio Design Canorus Praesto Revision Power Cable (power distributor and computers), Purist Audio Design Limited Edition Praesto Revision Power Cable (DAC) and Jupiter Pure Silver Cotton Insulated (all internal wires from the computers).

- Acessories: Furutech GTX-D (G); Furutech GTX-D ( R) (x2); Sunrise Deep Line (x3); ebony spikes, carbon fiber bases; Nordost Qv2 (x3); acoustical and electrical reinforcements.


#5 BernieK

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Posted 05 November 2021 - 12:17 AM

Happy Birthday Felipe!


  • FelipeRolim likes this

Control Point: Samsung Galaxy Tab S6 Lite, 128Gb storage, 4Gb RAM, Bubble UPnP 3.5.8, or Dell Inspiron 15R SE laptop (Windows Server 2019 - Standard Edition Desktop), Intel Core i7-3612QM, 2.1 GHz, 1Tb 5400 rpm SATA HDD, 16Gb Kingston DDR3 1600 MHz RAM, Upplay 1.4.10
Control and Audio-PCs: Asus Mini PC PN60, Intel Core i5 8250U 1.6 GHz, 250Gb Kingston A2000 M2 NVMe SSD (Control-PC) or 480Gb Kingston A1000 M2 NVMe SSD (Audio-PC) and 8Gb DDR4 2400 MHz RAM.

OS: Windows Server 2019 (Standard Edtion) in highly optimised Desktop mode, command prompt shell for initial setup after which both PCs run headless (no monitor, keyboard or mouse)
Optimization: Fidelizer Pro 8.6, MinorityClean 249, Process Lasso Server Edition 10.4.0.38, Audiophile Optimizer 3.0, a modified CAD DSK script, manual termination of specific Windows processes/services. Full optimization procedure described in my Guide for Optimizing WS2019 in a Dual or Single PC JPLAY Femto-Based System (revised 13/10/2021): (https://drive.google...iew?usp=sharing)

Renderer: JPLAY FEMTO 7.0D UPnP (Alternative version), Server: JPLAY FEMTO 7.0D femtoServer, File Manager: Q-Dir 10.4.0.0, Library Manager: JRiver MC 27.0.15
JPLAY Settings: Playing via: KS; Engine: ULTRAstream; Bitstream: Native; Bitperfect Volume: OFF; DAC Link: 500; XtreamSize: 1000; Throttle: ON; Hibernate Mode: ON
Equipment Configuration: Control Point Tablet/Laptop > WiFi > Control-PC > 1m SUPRA Cat 8 Ethernet Cable > Audio-PC > 3m Chord C-USB Cable > Luxman DA-06 > 1m Chord Chameleon Plus XLR cables > Luxman L-505ux MkII (or Luxman DA-06 > 1m ProA2 RCA cable > Rotel RC-1590 >  1m ProA2 RCA cable > Rotel RB-1590 or McIntosh MC152) > DIY speaker cables (Tycab PVC doubly insulated 11 AWG OFC wire, TechFlex braid, Neotech Banana/Spade connectors) > Bryston PX-1 external crossovers > DIY speaker cables (as before) > Bryston Model T Signature Speakers

Music Storage: Main Library: 6Tb Seagate HDD/Hub+6Tb Seagate HDD (all connections via 0.5m Avencore Premium USB 3.0 cables); Backups: as per Main Library (x2)


#6 RCDingen

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Posted 17 November 2021 - 02:16 PM

When i had a Mac Mini and replaced the disc drive with an ssd for music only and a ssd for operating system only sounded worse than operating system and music on one ssd.

I suspect the Sata bus for that.

I'm curious when you only use NVMe and disable the Sata ports what it will bring.

 

Rob



#7 FelipeRolim

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Posted 17 November 2021 - 11:39 PM

It's a complex way. On my system, turning off SATA connections has always resulted in a noticeable improvement. And I agree with you: using a single SSD is better than two SSDs as it seems to me that SATA connections suffer from this. But, it also depends on the motherboard. The best motherboards have independent controllers per SATA port, and on these the use of two SSDs is not as harmful as on motherboards where the SATA controller is unique for all ports.

 

In my case, as I use dual-PC mode, on the computer in the middle (Audio-PC) there is no SSD, either by SATA connection or by PCI-Express connection. I send the operating system to RAM memory through a pendrive, remove the pendrive and it works permanently from RAM. The improvement is quite noticeable, not only for RAMdisk, but also for turning off the SATA ports. On the computer where the songs are stored (Control-PC), I only use a singe SSD. I send the operating system to RAM and the SSD remains exclusive for reading music files. Nothing else. The improvement with this method is also more noticeable than using two SSDs. However, using a 2.5" SSD, with power independent of everything else (a fully dedicated power supply) and with a better quality SATA cable, the result is superior to using a regular NVMe SSD.

 

Hence the pertinence of my doubts: what is NVMe's responsibility? What is the responsibility of independent power supply? What is responsibility for using pseudo-SLC mode? What is high quality dedicated clock? I wish I could use the 2.5" SSD in pseudo-SLC mode to understand the differences/improvements.


- Speakers KEF Reference 203/2 with spikes;

- Schiit Freya preamp. (with Electro-Harmonix 6SN7 Gold-Pin tubes and Synergistic Research Orange Fuse) and Audio Research VS115 (with Tung-Sol KT120 and Svetlana 6H30 tubes and AMR Gold Fuse);

- DAC Ayre QB-9 192/24 + Furutech FI-03 ( R) + Synergistic Research Orange Fuse;

- Digital transport: the Control-PC is a dedicated computer with a Gigabyte H310N motherboard, a Intel Core i3-8100T processor, an Arctic Alpine 12 Passive Cooler, 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 RAM 2400MHz and 1TB Samsung 840 Evo SSD; the Audio-PC is a dedicated computer with a Gigabyte H310M M.2 2.0 motherboard, a Intel Core i3-9100T processor, an Arctic Alpine 12 Passive Cooler, 16GB Corsair Vengeance DDR4 RAM 2400MHz and a JCAT USB Card FEMTO. Both computers use Windows Server 2019 Datacenter Core Mode (17763.737) with RAMdisk as Operational System, JPLAY FEMTO Alternative version, Minority Clean and Audiophile Optimizer v. 3.00 (1A in Control-PC and 4D in Audio-PC). Both also use hand made linear power supplies with a Furutech FI-06 ( R).

- Cables: Nordost Tyr (speaker), Nordost Valhalla XLR and Siltech 770i XLR (interconnects), Curious Evolved USB Cable, Nordost Valhalla Power Cable (preamp.), Transparent PowerLink MM2 (power amp.), 2 x Purist Audio Design Canorus Praesto Revision Power Cable (power distributor and computers), Purist Audio Design Limited Edition Praesto Revision Power Cable (DAC) and Jupiter Pure Silver Cotton Insulated (all internal wires from the computers).

- Acessories: Furutech GTX-D (G); Furutech GTX-D ( R) (x2); Sunrise Deep Line (x3); ebony spikes, carbon fiber bases; Nordost Qv2 (x3); acoustical and electrical reinforcements.


#8 Jogar

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Posted 19 November 2021 - 08:54 AM

Hi Guys,

Not sure if my observations can help, but the SQ of my single PC improved when I added JCAT SATA DC power cables to the OS (Apacer SLC) and library SSD (TLC). They were already equipped with JCAT reference SATA data cables.

It suggested to me that 'standard' SATA power cables allow noise entry, giving the impression that SATA connectors are imperfect for audio SQ. Not planning to change my SSD setup any time soon.

Best regards.


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