Jump to content


Photo

From i7 SandyBridge to i7 9700 worth it?


  • Please log in to reply
17 replies to this topic

#1 ellisdj

ellisdj

    Die Hard

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 578 posts

Posted 05 November 2019 - 10:55 AM

Its been a long time since I put together the platform of an audio pc

I have been using an i7 2700k and P8Z77 mobo for years.

 

Is it really worth going from this old platform up to something like a newer coffee lake 8 core i7 with a lower TDP of 65W but not multiplier? with a Z390 Mobo

 

I am struggling to find a server and xeon setup that would suit me with integrated graphics and M ATX mobo - reasonably priced.

 

Its been a long time and I feel very out of the game when it comes to what is good

 

Thanks for any help

All the best 



#2 Jogar

Jogar

    Beginner

  • Members
  • 48 posts
  • LocationFrance

Posted 06 November 2019 - 09:55 PM

Hi ellisdj,

Here's my two cents for what it's worth. IMHO probably not much to be gained from going from your platform to a similar albeit more recent one. You could expect to get improvements with a server mobo and low TDP CPU, but as you pointed out, the new Supermicro mobos with Intel Xeon D are pricey especially if you need more than one PCIe slot. What some of us on the forum have done is to get a Supermicro X11SSL micro ATX mobo (available for about 250 euros) and an Intel Xeon E3 1240L (or similar) from Ebay or Aliexpress for about 50 euros. In addition, the X11SSL has 3 PCIe slots, DDR4 and integrated graphics (the E3 1240L doesn't), providing a cheaper solution. Mobos like these have good quality VRM, which is sometimes the case on gamer mobos, but less so on others. Stable voltages help good SQ. Another advantage of using low TDP platforms is obviously easier cooling in fanless cases but more importantly less 'work' for the power supply and potentially less noise generated by the mobo's components.

If you want to get a genuinely huge improvement in SQ with your current set up, then install JCAT DC cables for your SSDs, CPU and JCAT cards. That would be money well spent and you could be surprised.

I hope these thoughts can help. Your internet site is pretty cool. Kind regards.



#3 ellisdj

ellisdj

    Die Hard

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 578 posts

Posted 07 November 2019 - 10:42 AM

I have already done most of what you suggest I have lots of JCAT cards and cables.

In the end I have managed to find a Workstation motherboard to suit me and gone for a new Xeon 6 core CPU from the new 2100 family with apacer I industrial ram and industrial ssd.

This is not cheap but I am hoping it will yield a worthwhile and long term sensible investment
  • Jogar and Rob like this

#4 Rob

Rob

    Die Hard

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 110 posts
  • LocationStamford, England.

Posted 07 November 2019 - 10:56 AM

Hi would you mind sharing with us which motherboard you are using.
Kind Regards Rob.

#5 ellisdj

ellisdj

    Die Hard

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 578 posts

Posted 07 November 2019 - 12:55 PM

of course, I have ordered this asus motherboard

https://www.asus.com...s/WS-C246M-PRO/


Had it order it from US amazon

#6 Marcin_gps

Marcin_gps

    JPLAY team

  • Administrators
  • 3,628 posts

Posted 07 November 2019 - 01:54 PM

Terry, as I wrote in the email, I think that you will appreciate the jump to xeon and ECC RAM ;)

 

Best regards,

Marcin 

  • ellisdj likes this

JPLAY & JCAT Founder


JPLAY FEMTO: a complete network music software player for the most demanding audiophile.

Want to squeeze more from your PC-audio? Hear the difference with JCAT
 

#7 ellisdj

ellisdj

    Die Hard

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 578 posts

Posted 07 November 2019 - 02:15 PM

Thanks Marcin. I started this thread before I ordered the bits. Appreciate your help with it as always
  • Marcin_gps likes this

#8 Jogar

Jogar

    Beginner

  • Members
  • 48 posts
  • LocationFrance

Posted 07 November 2019 - 08:03 PM

Would be interesting to have your thoughts on SQ once your new Xeon 2100 platform is working.


  • Marcin_gps and ellisdj like this

#9 jaynyc

jaynyc

    Beginner

  • Members
  • 21 posts
  • LocationNew York

Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:55 PM

@ellisdj definitely interested in learning more about your  WS C246M PRO experience


  • ellisdj likes this

#10 ellisdj

ellisdj

    Die Hard

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 578 posts

Posted 03 December 2019 - 01:25 PM

I have been waiting weeks for the new Xeon CPUs to be out with delay after delay.  Its due for delivery today at last so I will be on the build asap.

 

Got Server 2019 to use with this new build - I hope the OS install all goes smoothly and everything from there - fingers crossed :)


  • Marcin_gps likes this

#11 wushuliu

wushuliu

    Die Hard

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 119 posts

Posted 03 December 2019 - 08:41 PM

It may be time to reconsider AMD compatibility. AMD is not the inferior-but-cheap brand it once was. They have made a lot of changes since 2016 and are now poised to dominate the market. Meanwhile Intel has hit a wall both with supply, performance and with future growth.

 

I have just switched over to AMD myself, having realized that any further intel upgrades would be throwing money away - but haven't had time to any serious audio listening yet. I would think that AMD's emphasis on core count and threads would vs. Ghz frequency would be more favorable to audio software.


  • Marcin_gps and Adrian like this

#12 ellisdj

ellisdj

    Die Hard

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 578 posts

Posted 06 December 2019 - 10:22 AM

I have started the build and there are a few things straight away that have been issues I didnt consider - with the Asus WS C246M Pro board and the JCAT PC case the cooling pipes run across the top of the RAM slots - I could only get 2 of the cooling pipes to fit the rest were too tight on the ram.

 

You can bend the cooling pipes but I am going to run with the 2 and see how I get on.

 

The second issue is the bios - the version it came with was terrible - it took about 8 attempts to get into the bios settings pressing the delete key on the keyboard.  I updated the bios and its better but on occasion it still doesn't seem to work.

 

Hopefully there will be a more stable bios down the line there often is as we know.  That is as far as I have got so far :) 

 

PS Install your ram before the cooling pipes otherwise all the effort you go to to install all 8 pipes neatly with the perfect amount of TIM goes to waste - not speaking from experience of course :) 


  • Thuan, ciccio1112 and Jogar like this

#13 Thuan

Thuan

    Die Hard

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,605 posts
  • LocationCalifornia

Posted 06 December 2019 - 01:39 PM

Thanks for sharing your hands on experience.

P.S. It's utterly critical to take good care of heat cooling and BIOS access before doing anything else on a new or unoptimized server, so the above heads up are very helpful at least to me a clumsy and usually jump-the-gun boy.
  • ellisdj and Jogar like this

WS2019 ServerDaterCenter 10.0.17763.1217, dualPC, AO3 - 1A/2D, Fidelizer Pro 8.5, JPLAY Femto, BubbleUPnP.


#14 ellisdj

ellisdj

    Die Hard

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 578 posts

Posted 08 December 2019 - 09:31 AM

I have been running the server for the last 24 or so hours and my case is at room temperature. Before it would have been noticeably warm the new xeon cpu has a lower rated tdp but in reality its generating a lot less heat. That bit I was a little worried about but without need to be so that is great.

I havent done any optimizations yet literally none but the sound quality now is showing me the potential for when I have so that is exciting.

Server 2019 datacentre I am using as the OS feels more stripped down than server 2016 I was running previously I havent seen Cortana or auto update or anything annoying like that yet. I am running in GUI mode as I dont have the skills to work in core mode which is a shame so there are a lot of improvements to be made from shutting the graphic services down etc. This made a huge improvement difference before so I expect the same again

I have to get my head around the new bios to work out what I can turn off. I was hoping it would be similar to my previous asus bios making my life easier but its not it's totally different with a ton of options to trial and error / google - :)

I will say I have the luxury of having the JCAT M12 Gold switch here atm and that is a great thing for making the system sound much better

Moral of this story so far I have taken more of Marcins great advice and as always that advice has never let me down or wasted my time and money. Thanks Marcin you are the man


  • Marcin_gps, Adrian, Thuan and 2 others like this

#15 Marcin_gps

Marcin_gps

    JPLAY team

  • Administrators
  • 3,628 posts

Posted 09 December 2019 - 03:41 PM

I have been running the server for the last 24 or so hours and my case is at room temperature. Before it would have been noticeably warm the new xeon cpu has a lower rated tdp but in reality its generating a lot less heat. That bit I was a little worried about but without need to be so that is great.

I havent done any optimizations yet literally none but the sound quality now is showing me the potential for when I have so that is exciting.

Server 2019 datacentre I am using as the OS feels more stripped down than server 2016 I was running previously I havent seen Cortana or auto update or anything annoying like that yet. I am running in GUI mode as I dont have the skills to work in core mode which is a shame so there are a lot of improvements to be made from shutting the graphic services down etc. This made a huge improvement difference before so I expect the same again

I have to get my head around the new bios to work out what I can turn off. I was hoping it would be similar to my previous asus bios making my life easier but its not it's totally different with a ton of options to trial and error / google - :)

I will say I have the luxury of having the JCAT M12 Gold switch here atm and that is a great thing for making the system sound much better

Moral of this story so far I have taken more of Marcins great advice and as always that advice has never let me down or wasted my time and money. Thanks Marcin you are the man

Good to hear - please keep us posted :)

 

Regards, 

Marcin


  • ellisdj likes this

JPLAY & JCAT Founder


JPLAY FEMTO: a complete network music software player for the most demanding audiophile.

Want to squeeze more from your PC-audio? Hear the difference with JCAT
 

#16 ellisdj

ellisdj

    Die Hard

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 578 posts

Posted 14 December 2019 - 12:02 PM

Major Update Time.

So I reinstalled WS 2019 after turning off everything in my Mobo Bios I dared to.
I left a few things on but all the C states and everything CPU related I turned off.

I have been waiting for Fidelizer to send me through the new copy to suit this new PC. I decided to sod it and just run AO and see how I got on.

I also had to use a different activation code for AO3 to my original one not sure why but luckily we get 5 with AO so I had a few spare and only wasted 1 which shouldn't be a wasted one but nevermind.

The fact I am starting again made me look at a few things, how I am using the Dirac Live software etc and I have made some changes there for the better in terms of balancing the sound better from bottom to top - hugely important as important if not more important than anything else imo. Ultimately the frequency response at the MLP is what we hear right

This time rather than disabling any services I just manually stopped them which means they will start again on a reboot which is ok for now.

I then ran the CAD scripts shell killer and desktop services killer to get more services shut down etc. Pretty standard.

What I have noticed with this build is when the monitor shuts off the system sounds a lot better - I assume that's integrated GPU in the CPU related and makes me appreciate Marcins advice on using a cpu with no gpu built in - worth noting for anyone considering doing this.

So how does it sound - A HUGE amount better than before which has shocked me actually. It's hard for me to now attribute what to what but I think it's the combination of all of it as we know everything matters and counts.

I am confident there is more to come as well with things I am still to do etc.

I will be honest the audio PC life can be frustrating and infuriating when you have problems and breakages and starting agains and all the other negatives. But when you listen to a really good audio PC setup with JPLAY and JCAT parts and advice it does make you fall back in love with it again and justifies the stress and sleepless nights.

Thanks again to Marcin and the other people we have to thank for making all this possible and accessible to us all :) I am eternally grateful to you.
  • Marcin_gps, screenmusic, Thuan and 3 others like this

#17 Marcin_gps

Marcin_gps

    JPLAY team

  • Administrators
  • 3,628 posts

Posted 16 December 2019 - 11:45 AM

Good to hear - looking forward to see (and hear) the new setup on YouTube :) 


JPLAY & JCAT Founder


JPLAY FEMTO: a complete network music software player for the most demanding audiophile.

Want to squeeze more from your PC-audio? Hear the difference with JCAT
 

#18 mdskier

mdskier

    Beginner

  • Members
  • 11 posts

Posted 16 December 2019 - 03:49 PM

Major Update Time.

So I reinstalled WS 2019 after turning off everything in my Mobo Bios I dared to.
I left a few things on but all the C states and everything CPU related I turned off.

I have been waiting for Fidelizer to send me through the new copy to suit this new PC. I decided to sod it and just run AO and see how I got on.

I also had to use a different activation code for AO3 to my original one not sure why but luckily we get 5 with AO so I had a few spare and only wasted 1 which shouldn't be a wasted one but nevermind.

The fact I am starting again made me look at a few things, how I am using the Dirac Live software etc and I have made some changes there for the better in terms of balancing the sound better from bottom to top - hugely important as important if not more important than anything else imo. Ultimately the frequency response at the MLP is what we hear right

This time rather than disabling any services I just manually stopped them which means they will start again on a reboot which is ok for now.

I then ran the CAD scripts shell killer and desktop services killer to get more services shut down etc. Pretty standard.

What I have noticed with this build is when the monitor shuts off the system sounds a lot better - I assume that's integrated GPU in the CPU related and makes me appreciate Marcins advice on using a cpu with no gpu built in - worth noting for anyone considering doing this.

So how does it sound - A HUGE amount better than before which has shocked me actually. It's hard for me to now attribute what to what but I think it's the combination of all of it as we know everything matters and counts.

I am confident there is more to come as well with things I am still to do etc.

I will be honest the audio PC life can be frustrating and infuriating when you have problems and breakages and starting agains and all the other negatives. But when you listen to a really good audio PC setup with JPLAY and JCAT parts and advice it does make you fall back in love with it again and justifies the stress and sleepless nights.

Thanks again to Marcin and the other people we have to thank for making all this possible and accessible to us all :) I am eternally grateful to you.

 

 

Instead of using an integrated GPU the recommendation is to use an external GPU?  Once the system is setup do you then remove the external GPU from the system?  Will it still boot?  If no GPU installed how do you do maintenance?






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users