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#61 Sligolad

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Posted 14 May 2015 - 06:45 PM

It could have a lot to do with how these cables manage the ground plane as there is definitely a big difference between your off the shelf good quality cheap SATA cable and the JCAT & PPA cables.

Why I say this is because I have a Black and several Red PPA SATA cables which I have been using happily for some time and until recently in my highest spec audio PC.

Once I went multi-rail Linear power supplies with an OCXO USB Card, OCXO on Mobo and OS SSD drive with TCXO I have struggled with these PPA SATA cables.

 

First off the Black PPA Sata did not want to allow boot or work reliably on the OS SSD drive with TCXO but changing to an off the shelf good quality cheap SATA cable and everything worked fine, so the Black PPA Sata is now sitting happily on my other Audio PC on the SSD OS drive without clock mods but with Teradak PS.

 

Shortly after that Red PPA Sata cable on the Music SSD was causing some issues so again by changing to an off the shelf good quality cheap SATA cable for the Music SSD and everything worked fine, so the Red PPA Sata is now sitting happily on my other Audio PC on the Music SSD drive without clock mods but with Teradak PS.

 

All very strange but this whole custom work on Audio PCs does throw up some inexplicably challenges and results and I have a suspicion that the grounds across all the various items have a lot to do with it.


Audio PC Gigabyte H97M-D3H & PPA OCXO Mobo, Teradak ATX Linear for 20 pin ATX on Mobo, Paul Hynes SR7EHD 12v for Mobo, 5v for clocks & 5v supply to Audiowind Regulator for 1.3v to RAM direct, JCat Femto USB Card 5v from Paul Hynes, Startech Lex – Amber Regen to JCat USB & Startech Rex to Lex by 2x Meicord LAN through GISO GB Isolator powered by Teddy Pardo 18v Linear, Wtfplay off USB on REX – remote control by Mele F10, D to D PPA Red USB Cable - Intona - LFP 3.3v battery powered USB Regen – Isolated Xmos 768kHz USB DDC powered by 2 x 3.3v 0.8uV Linear Regs – i2s - D to A - Lampizator Big7, Conrad Johnson Premier 17LS, Classe CA 2200, Raidho C1s. Recent changes in red.


#62 Hifidelit

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Posted 16 May 2015 - 02:36 PM

Pearse

 

Did you get the bios screen and then no further boot (as if the drive was missing) with the OS drive?  

What were the issues with the music drive?



#63 Sligolad

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Posted 16 May 2015 - 07:03 PM

 

Did you get the bios screen and then no further boot (as if the drive was missing) with the OS drive?  

That was pretty much what was happening from memory, sometimes it would be picked up in bios but still would not boot.

The music drive similar as it just started dropping off during boot so was not seen.


Audio PC Gigabyte H97M-D3H & PPA OCXO Mobo, Teradak ATX Linear for 20 pin ATX on Mobo, Paul Hynes SR7EHD 12v for Mobo, 5v for clocks & 5v supply to Audiowind Regulator for 1.3v to RAM direct, JCat Femto USB Card 5v from Paul Hynes, Startech Lex – Amber Regen to JCat USB & Startech Rex to Lex by 2x Meicord LAN through GISO GB Isolator powered by Teddy Pardo 18v Linear, Wtfplay off USB on REX – remote control by Mele F10, D to D PPA Red USB Cable - Intona - LFP 3.3v battery powered USB Regen – Isolated Xmos 768kHz USB DDC powered by 2 x 3.3v 0.8uV Linear Regs – i2s - D to A - Lampizator Big7, Conrad Johnson Premier 17LS, Classe CA 2200, Raidho C1s. Recent changes in red.


#64 Hifidelit

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 09:35 AM

Your signature is a bit hard to work out is the Gigabyte h97m dh3 board with the Teradak and is that the one that's OK with the PPA? Was it the same board with the separate linears or a different make that had the problems?



#65 Sligolad

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 03:09 PM

My main Audio PC is all that is listed in my signature and it is setup with both Teradak & Paul Hynes.

 

I have a dedicated Audio PC in a Streacom case with Gigabyte Mobo H97M-D3H & Intel I7 4770S & Paul Pang Audio OCXO replacement, a Paul Pang Audio V4 USB Card with OCXO, a Teradak ATX Linear Supply just for the 20 pin ATX connector on the Mobo, the Paul Hynes SR7EHD 12v goes to the 12v CPU supply connector on the Mobo, the first Paul Hynes SR7EHD 5v supplies the 2 OCXO's,
the second Paul Hynes SR7EHD 5v supplies the Operating System Paul Pang Audio TCXO SSD + Music SSD + a separate Audiowind regulator which bypasses the on-board 1.5v supply to RAM.

I run Server 2012 R2 Essentials in Core mode loaded in to RAMDISK on start-up, JPlay 6 & Audiophils Optimiser 1.26b.

 

I have other Audio PCs which I have not listed in my signature for development and comparison.

It is one of these other audio PCs with Streacom case, Asus P9D-M Server Board,& Intel I7 4770S, JCat USB Card, SSD for OS & SSD for Music powered by Teradak which runs fine with the PPA SATA Cables now that I have taken them out of my main audio PC.

I also run Server 2012 R2 Essentials in Core mode loaded in to RAMDISK on start-up, JPlay 6 & Audiophils Optimiser 1.26b on this PC.

 

I hope to give dual PC setup another try this year with this second PC as control PC and I still have the Giso Isolator and 2 Meicord cables from my original Dual PC setup for direct connection.

Its great to have so many options now but it can be difficult to keep up!!


Audio PC Gigabyte H97M-D3H & PPA OCXO Mobo, Teradak ATX Linear for 20 pin ATX on Mobo, Paul Hynes SR7EHD 12v for Mobo, 5v for clocks & 5v supply to Audiowind Regulator for 1.3v to RAM direct, JCat Femto USB Card 5v from Paul Hynes, Startech Lex – Amber Regen to JCat USB & Startech Rex to Lex by 2x Meicord LAN through GISO GB Isolator powered by Teddy Pardo 18v Linear, Wtfplay off USB on REX – remote control by Mele F10, D to D PPA Red USB Cable - Intona - LFP 3.3v battery powered USB Regen – Isolated Xmos 768kHz USB DDC powered by 2 x 3.3v 0.8uV Linear Regs – i2s - D to A - Lampizator Big7, Conrad Johnson Premier 17LS, Classe CA 2200, Raidho C1s. Recent changes in red.


#66 emaspac

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 03:11 PM

Some days ago I have got the same experience with my JCAT SATA cable after a BIOS upgrade.

Now I have always the BIOS screen and then no further boot (as if the drive was missing) with the OS drive.

I powered my single audio PC with Teradak LPSU ATX, JCAT Battery PSU for OS drive, Paul Hynes LPSU for SOtM tx-USBexp.

This power setup works fine with the previous version of the BIOS and JCAT SATA cable.

After the BIOS upgrade I can't boot the audio PC if I use JCAT SATA; I tried all SATA ports and BIOS settings with no luck.

Also I came back to Pico PSU for a try, no luck.

When I use the JCAT SATA cable, the only way to get the OS drive visible is set RAID into BIOS configuration, but even if I can see the two partitions of Windows 8 as bootable drives, it will fail the boot (of course).

Standard SATA cables work fine, i.e. I can boot my PC


 

Server: CAPS v4 Pipeline, SOtM tX-USBexp PCI, JCAT SATA Cable & Battery for OS SSD
SW: Win 2012 OS loaded in RAM, JMini + JPlay 6 + Dirac Live, ProcessLasso
PSU: Teradak ATX 210 LPS, Paul Hynes SR7EHD 2 Rails
DDC: Berkeley Audio Alpha USB  --->  Genesis Digital Lens (AT&T Fiber Out)
DAC: Wadia 2000 Digimaster (Sledgehammer Buffer, AT&T Fiber In)
Tube Amplifier: Leben CS-600 
Loudspeakers: Sony SS-A5 "La Voce"
Power Conditioners: Accuphase PS-510, UberBUSS (euro version), Einstein NF6020, Kemp Power Source+, Kemp Power Station 75, Clearaudio APG

 


#67 Hifidelit

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 03:30 PM

That's interesting Pearse as I've had a problem with the Asus P9D-I server board but with various PSUs, I'll have a chat with Pang.

 

Emaspac was that with the dh77eb board in the Zuma?



#68 emaspac

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Posted 17 May 2015 - 03:37 PM

it's giga z87mx-d3h mobo.


 

Server: CAPS v4 Pipeline, SOtM tX-USBexp PCI, JCAT SATA Cable & Battery for OS SSD
SW: Win 2012 OS loaded in RAM, JMini + JPlay 6 + Dirac Live, ProcessLasso
PSU: Teradak ATX 210 LPS, Paul Hynes SR7EHD 2 Rails
DDC: Berkeley Audio Alpha USB  --->  Genesis Digital Lens (AT&T Fiber Out)
DAC: Wadia 2000 Digimaster (Sledgehammer Buffer, AT&T Fiber In)
Tube Amplifier: Leben CS-600 
Loudspeakers: Sony SS-A5 "La Voce"
Power Conditioners: Accuphase PS-510, UberBUSS (euro version), Einstein NF6020, Kemp Power Source+, Kemp Power Station 75, Clearaudio APG

 


#69 motberg

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 12:42 AM

Pearse

 

Did you get the bios screen and then no further boot (as if the drive was missing) with the OS drive?  

 

I get exactly the same thing in about 1 out of 30 boots. In every case it starts on the next boot after a hard shutdown.. here is my single PC:

Gigabyte GA-Z87M-D3H, I5-4670t, NOFAN CR-95c, 2x4 GB Corsair, TeraDak 210 ATX LPS with separate 5V line for PPA V2 USB card, PPA battery pack on 32GB OS SSD, PS/2 mouse, USB back-lit keyboard, on-board video, 256GB SSD for music (all WAV files), both SSD's use PPA red thin SATA cables, additional internal storage via a 500GB mSATA w/SAT32MSATM port-mounted adapter. WIN2012 and AO (4A, no USB optimization), JPlay Mini, Total Commander.



#70 kaka

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Posted 18 May 2015 - 05:48 AM

This is interesting - my Jplay Sata cables are in the control machine because the audio machine couldn't see the O/S drive with the sata cable in place

The mobo is a Gigabyte GA-H87N-WIFI Mini-ITX


Linear+battery power supplied machine - Roonserver, HQPlayer, AO, Fideliser, Process Lasso - Jcat USB board - Chord USB - Mutec reclocker on linear supply - Stereolab Tron spdif - Lampizator Big 7


#71 jamiee

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Posted 26 May 2015 - 09:03 PM

Interesting indeed.... 

I switched to Intel X99 a few months back (Asus Rampage V Extreme) and almost imediately started having problems with my two JCAT SATA cables.

One cable outright stopped working (BIOS doesn't see SSD), the other works but I found that the OS install (Win 8.1) was being degraded over time and would start to show intermittant problems within a matter of days.

 

So I swapped out the JCAT for my Bitfenix sleeved SATA cables - performed a clean re-install, and everything has been good since.

 

Previous motherboard was an X79 - Rampage IV Extreme Black Edition.  The JCAT's didn't seem to have a probem with this board.



#72 highstream

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Posted 29 October 2015 - 08:01 PM

The question I have is it the motherboard or what it's connected to?  Frequent boot problems into Win 8.1 showed up immediately upon installing the JCAT SATA cable onto a new Samsung 850 Pro SSD. The motherboard, a Gigabyte Z97-UD5H-BK, was a month old and had been working fine until that time.  I recently changed back to an OEM SATA cable and it boots through now every time. Marcin's out of ideas. What have others done, if anything to solve their problem?

 

Update: I tried additional testing by changing the JCAT's port on the motherboard and then hooking the other end to an HDD. That worked fine a few times. However, hooking it again to the SSD failed to boot through right off. That suggested the problem might be on Samsung SSD end. So I left the changed mobo port but turned the JCAT cable around, to see if its connector is the issue. Thus far I've gotten three good reboots. Good news?  Hope so, but won't know without a much larger sample, since it's not unusual to get two or three good days in a row.  That leaves only the original motherboard SATA port to check.



#73 Sligolad

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Posted 29 October 2015 - 10:59 PM

I do not think it has anything to do with the SSD's but more likely with noise or some potential on the ground plane and across neutrals on power supplies.

This noise probably finds an easy route over the custom SATA cables thereby messing with the SATA handshake....all only guessing from my side.

 

What I find is that computer monitors particularly have a very bad effect on these issues.

Even with a standard SATA cable on the PPA OS SATA Drive which works repeatedly now for months all I have to do is move the SMPS power supply for the PC monitor off the main AC outlet to another outlet and the OS Drive does not want to boot, change it back to the mains line that all the other equipment is on will get things booting reliably again.

 

Try isolating the SSD case by fixing with double sided tape and no screws and if that does not work try moving any powered peripherals like monitors to different power sockets.

 

My next area for testing next year will be around different isolation and grounding experiments to see if I can get a handle on this as it is an area I know little about.

Cheers, Pearse.


Audio PC Gigabyte H97M-D3H & PPA OCXO Mobo, Teradak ATX Linear for 20 pin ATX on Mobo, Paul Hynes SR7EHD 12v for Mobo, 5v for clocks & 5v supply to Audiowind Regulator for 1.3v to RAM direct, JCat Femto USB Card 5v from Paul Hynes, Startech Lex – Amber Regen to JCat USB & Startech Rex to Lex by 2x Meicord LAN through GISO GB Isolator powered by Teddy Pardo 18v Linear, Wtfplay off USB on REX – remote control by Mele F10, D to D PPA Red USB Cable - Intona - LFP 3.3v battery powered USB Regen – Isolated Xmos 768kHz USB DDC powered by 2 x 3.3v 0.8uV Linear Regs – i2s - D to A - Lampizator Big7, Conrad Johnson Premier 17LS, Classe CA 2200, Raidho C1s. Recent changes in red.


#74 Audiophile Neuroscience

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Posted 05 April 2016 - 01:50 AM

Hi All,

Has the problem with the SATA cable recognizing the music and boot ssd drives been solved ?

 

I have noticed there has been no updates on this topic since October 2015. I also notice there is a JCAT SATA v2 cable out now, stating greater compatibility with ssd's,mobos, and better sound quality....but I can't see any thread discussing this.

 

Any feedback appeciated

 

Cheers

David



#75 Marcin_gps

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Posted 05 April 2016 - 12:53 PM

Hi David, 

 

Yes, compatibility issues should be solved now with the updated JCAT SATA v2. I was going to announce it officially together with other new JCAT products coming this month :)

 

 

Regards, 

Marcin


JPLAY & JCAT Founder


JPLAY FEMTO: a complete network music software player for the most demanding audiophile.

Want to squeeze more from your PC-audio? Hear the difference with JCAT
 

#76 Audiophile Neuroscience

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Posted 05 April 2016 - 03:11 PM


Yes, compatibility issues should be solved now with the updated JCAT SATA v2. I was going to announce it officially together with other new JCAT products coming this month :)

Regards, 

Marcin

Hi Marcin,

sorry to preempt your announcement :o

 

The reason I ask about compatibility is that I have one original JCAT SATA cable bought in 2015 for a friend. We both have identical servers but due to delays in manufacturing of the HDPlex gear, we just finished building them. We only bought one SATA cable to compare it with the server sans JCAT SATA. We were both impressed with the sound quality difference the JCAT made used on the music ssd but noticed the drive frequently drops out, not seen by Windows 10. I found this thread researching the problem.

 

We are now looking at getting more and would obviously go for the v2 of the SATA cable.

 

Questions:

1) Are we able to Swap the SATA v1 for a v2?

 

2) We are also looking at the JCAT reference usb cable and JCAT usb card. Should we hold off until the "new product announcements" are made?

 

Thanks Marcin

Cheers

David



#77 Marcin_gps

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Posted 05 April 2016 - 03:32 PM

Hi Marcin,

sorry to preempt your announcement :o

 

The reason I ask about compatibility is that I have one original JCAT SATA cable bought in 2015 for a friend. We both have identical servers but due to delays in manufacturing of the HDPlex gear, we just finished building them. We only bought one SATA cable to compare it with the server sans JCAT SATA. We were both impressed with the sound quality difference the JCAT made used on the music ssd but noticed the drive frequently drops out, not seen by Windows 10. I found this thread researching the problem.

 

We are now looking at getting more and would obviously go for the v2 of the SATA cable.

 

Questions:

1) Are we able to Swap the SATA v1 for a v2?

 

2) We are also looking at the JCAT reference usb cable and JCAT usb card. Should we hold off until the "new product announcements" are made?

 

Thanks Marcin

Cheers

David

Hi David, 

 

What SSD and motherboard do you use. Maybe I can help. Sometimes adjusting few options in BIOS does the trick. 

 

1) Unfortunately that won't be possible. 

 

2) Definitely not. These products will remain in our offer for some time :)

 

Regards, 

Marcin


JPLAY & JCAT Founder


JPLAY FEMTO: a complete network music software player for the most demanding audiophile.

Want to squeeze more from your PC-audio? Hear the difference with JCAT
 

#78 Audiophile Neuroscience

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Posted 05 April 2016 - 09:09 PM


What SSD and motherboard do you use. Maybe I can help. Sometimes adjusting few options in BIOS does the trick. 

 

1) Unfortunately that won't be possible. 

 

2) Definitely not. These products will remain in our offer for some time :)

 

Regards, 

Marcin

Hi Marcin


OS Drive is Samsung 850 Pro 128GB [MZ-7KE128BW] 2.5 inch SATA3 - Solid State Drive

     

Music Drive is Samsung 850 PRO 1TB - MZ-7KE1T0BW - 2.5 SATA3 - Solid State Drive



#79 Marcin_gps

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Posted 06 April 2016 - 08:13 AM

Ahh, Supermicro. I also have Supermicro in one of my PCs. I remember that I had to switch one option off in BIOS. I'm on the road today, will let you know which one is it once I'm back

 

Regards,
Marcin


JPLAY & JCAT Founder


JPLAY FEMTO: a complete network music software player for the most demanding audiophile.

Want to squeeze more from your PC-audio? Hear the difference with JCAT
 

#80 Marcin_gps

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Posted 07 April 2016 - 02:39 PM

Please try adjusting the following options in BIOS:

- SATA AHCI LPM - set to disabled

- SATA SMART - set to disabled

- Hot Plug - set to disabled

 

Let me know how it goes!

 

Regards, 

Marcin


JPLAY & JCAT Founder


JPLAY FEMTO: a complete network music software player for the most demanding audiophile.

Want to squeeze more from your PC-audio? Hear the difference with JCAT
 



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